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Places like Graingers, McMaster-Carr, Fastenal, Airgas and IDG are all too big for their britches and I buy from them only when I have to. The first sign of a place that is too big is high price, next is when they start to dictate to their customer, Then rules to have the privalidge to buy from them.
Making people want to shop on your site makes you more money, not less. Thats why sites who do it right flourish and can charge more or sell more because of that, and sites who do it wrong don't. Its not a luxury you are bestowing upon "demanding" customers. Its how you grow your business.Quote:
Originally Posted by everlastsupport
Anyways, I got the correct DINSE plug in the mail today.
An lo-and-behold, whaddya know, the -24 version doesn't come with the everlast gas quick connector. Another example of important minutia that gets lost in the fog of ordering from badly designed web stores. Now if everything had been located on one page, listing what each version comes with as far as gas connectors, do you think I'd miss that? And if you think I deserve to be blamed for this, I don't think so. I cant be expected to spend an hour of my time checking and rechecking every specification and verifying compatibility when I'm buying a part like this and that information is either spread out over random documents on the CK site, or simply non-existant. I'll do that when I'm buying a welder, but if I'm buying an accessory or consumable, that information should be made clear as day wherever I'm buying it.
I still had the other wrong DINSE connector so I stole the quick disconnect off of it and swapped it onto the -24 one. I also swapped the gas hoses because the -24 version is much longer than needed.
The clamshell housing on the DINSE is nice and everything plugged into the welder solid.
My first welding attempt was on the more difficult (for me) welds of what I bought this torch for. A 0.1" tall, 1/16" wide, rim on a big block of 6061 being welded to a 0.058" wall tube.
Things went very easy with a 1/16" electrode and gas lens on the new torch. The new cable is so flexible I cant even keep it on the table. The old torches cable was so heavy and stiff I couldn't move it when I needed, now its like the opposite problem lol. But its much lighter and I'm sure I can just make a hook or something to float it up in the air.
The flex head of the torch is GREAT! And this 24 series is TINY and light. Its a huge difference from the 18 series.
Strangely, after welding up this piece, the torch was barely warm to the touch. Just off the top of my head I'm pretty sure my old torch would have been hot..maybe I'm wrong about that though.
So all in all I think I have the right tools for the job now and its up to improving my technique, which really needs it.
I'm sure I'm not the only person who would like to get a CK torch for an everlast welder. Why not just have a few "kits" which make it really easy and fast to get the torch, all the consumables that go with it, the quick disconnect connector, and the DINSE connector, and fit it all in a USPS priority mail box for 11$ shipping anywhere in the USA.
Have a kit like that for each of the CK series torches you'd think would be popular..130, 24, 24 water cooled, etc..
Make it so easy its hard to resist.
I'm pretty sure now I've caught some kind of bug and I will be getting the 100/130 series so I can get that gas saver plexigas kit (doesnt work with 24 series yet).
And then after that the water cooled 24 series..
And hopefully I stop there lol
Heck maybe I should become a CK distributor, I could do a helluva job better than anyone else whos doing it.
Maybe we should all set up a big group buy with the torches we want and then place the order all at once, not to get a discount necessarily, but to get it shipped cheap and get everything correct the first time.
http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/f...psjyu7sqsm.jpg
http://i242.photobucket.com/albums/f...ps4cqj3z7r.jpg
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one more thing..I noticed this torch had a much harder time starting an arc than I am used to..any ideas why?
You probably don't realize that CK lists close to 5000 items in their catalog. Good luck with listing cross compatability. One torch can have potentially 20 different configurations. They have a new quick connect fitting for the torch and the water cooler that adapts. That's two different part numbers if you order separately, and three fittings. But if you order the correct DINSE adapter, to begin with, that's still ordering 2 different part numbers, but only 2 additional fittings.
And yes, we have put together kits and packages on the most common items. Take the TL 26 for example with the stubby kit. But when you have so many different configurations for a lot of different brands the best way to do it is to create a modular design like CK has and sell sub components to go with you torch to reduce the amount of inventory you have to count and stock, and pay taxes on.
With the 9 size (CK 2 series) gas lens you're using, the torch looks as big as a 9 without the back cap.
One of the nice things about calling Everlast to place an order is that you just tell them what you want and they do all the work.
You know you may have a point here....if I was definitely going to order a CK100 I might just call up Everlast and say "CK100 plus 1 of every consumable please, plus the gas saver kit please, shipped to blah blah" and if its really that easy it might be worth it.Quote:
Originally Posted by zoama
The problem is when getting this kind of stuff is that you need to see everything to make a decision what to buy..its not always just about ordering what you know, its seeing whats available, whats new, and how much everything costs, to make the decision.
I'd be up for trying out a set-it-and-forget-it phone order with Everlase except I think a 24 series water cooled is more appropriate and now I'm pretty familiar with what it takes :/
its because i had the ground clamp clamped to the table and not the part isnt it ..derpQuote:
Originally Posted by acannell
Well, then you will get hundreds of bits and pieces. :OQuote:
Originally Posted by acannell
The reason why all these parts are broken out the way they are, is that there are a crazy number of different combinations. Some are more general while others are very specialized. Again, none of this was designed for inexperienced consumers, but tailored to the demands of industrial users with a fair amount of knowledge about what is out there and what they need for a specific application. For example, the combination you put together is something I haven't seen used in that way before. A 9 series gas lens on a 24 body is interesting. Generally when I'm using a 24, space is at a premium and the super small shorty cups are used. As zoama mentioned, that is very close to the size of a 9 torch with the smallest back cap, but without the ability to change as many pieces. However, if it fits for your application then it might just be ideal, for you. There are a staggering array of options, so it is very easy to order parts that might not work with your particular combination. But that same variety, makes it so that once you understand the part system, you can assemble a combination to work with virtually any piece of equipment, across multiple brands and options. That flexibility entails some complication, no doubt about it, and it can be a little intimidating to the n00b, but it works very well for experienced industrial customers, and that is their focus.
BTW, an 18 is a water cooled torch and really shouldn't be getting hot. If you run it without water, it will damage the torch in short order.
Where did you come up with that? Everlast, Miller, Lincoln, etc.. dont target hobbyist welders? I'm pretty sure they'd beg to differ. And even if that were true, which it is absolutely not, why would someones tolerance for wasting time and money suddenly go up when they are doing it for work? There is no such thing as this imaginary "industrial buyer" who already knows everything. Thats why huge sites like McMaster and Grainger make a big effort to help out in that regard. I've worked at several companies with buyers, and even in medical device engineering firms, if you want the right things ordered, you better do it yourself, unless its been through production for years and you can just hand them a list that says NO ALTERNATES. Buyers are low paid and unskilled, they almost never understand what they are buying, they man a computer with an excel spreadsheet and a phone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rambozo
Its straight out of the CK exploded parts view for this torch.Quote:
For example, the combination you put together is something I haven't seen used in that way before. A 9 series gas lens on a 24 body is interesting.
There shouldn't be anything to understand when ordering consumables for welding, besides knowing what fits what and what the sizes of things are, all of which should be made clear to you on the ordering page. As far as knowing how to use those things, thats where you get paid to be a welder. What you are doing is justifying a bad way of selling things by saying it just needs to be learned, as if somehow thats okay because learning is always a good thing. Thats wrong, and its wasting the time of whoever is paying the person to learn it, whether that be a buyer, an inexperienced welder, an experienced welder getting a new torch style or something they simply arent familiar with, etc... Learning how to navigate the pointless maze of welding consumables is a huge waste of time.Quote:
But that same variety, makes it so that once you understand the part system, you can assemble a combination to work with virtually any piece of equipment, across multiple brands and options. That flexibility entails some complication, no doubt about it, and it can be a little intimidating to the n00b, but it works very well for experienced industrial customers, and that is their focus.
According to Everlast I can use it up to 200A without water, the usual duty cycle derating applies, just like using any torch above its current rating. I emailed them about that years ago. And I've been using it for years without water at ~150A.Quote:
BTW, an 18 is a water cooled torch and really shouldn't be getting hot. If you run it without water, it will damage the torch in short order.
Theres alot of "making stuff up" in blue collar industries I've noticed, and it doesn't help when the tools they use are obfuscated under layers of poor catalogs, online or printed. It makes seeing the big picture alot harder and people end up selecting equipment that might not really fit the bill, out of simple ignorance of whats available and what the specifications are. What I'm saying is, its not the WELDERS fault, they are trying to do their job/hobby, they don't get anything from wasting their time with bad websites. What you are saying is, it IS the WELDERS fault.
NO. NO. NO. You can't, and we shouldn't have. That was our mistake based off of faulty factory supplied info. Disregard that for the future if you were told that. The old economy torches were built a little differently and the factory said they could be used, (but I never heard up to 200 amps that I can recall). They'd hold up for a little while but would evenutally and inevitably break down. But Your torch is toast if that is what you've been doing for very long.
Rambozo was referring to CK. They target professionals, and have until the last two or three years when social media came into its own. They do have an app that tells you which common Everlast units fit their most common torches and what you need. Just released in 2012. But they refuse to do certain machines as they do not "want" to pursuit that type customer. http://www.ckworldwide.com/Form_453.pdf
It was years ago maybe 2010 that I asked about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by performance
I've gone through maybe 400cf of Argon since I've owned the welder. I'm assuming that would be considered light duty so maybe thats why the torch is still working great. Or maybe its just made well lol! I had to take it apart recently because it was leaking a little bit when I hooked up water for the first time, because one of the hose fittings inside had screwed loose over the years. Everything inside looked great still..its a "New Cent." and say WP18 on it.
So I just went to the everlast torch page to pretend I was buying something. I think anyone would admit that putting the torches without pictures in a single column makes it extremely difficult not to lose track of which one you are looking at. All the specs look similar and its impossible to compare them with out scrolling back and forth, and you get lost that way really easy because everything looks the same.
So I made a little spreadsheet with all the specs.
It would take not 30 minutes for a web designer to put this kind of thing up on the site. Add links to "Add to Cart" and you have a much more functional way for people to browse and compare your torches. Most sites do tables like this with sort arrows and filtering pull downs so you can quickly find what you want.
Now how cool would it be if I made one of these but for a couple dozen CK torches and also something similar for all their consumables and special "CK" exclusive stuff like their extra stubby cups and gas saver stuff?
BTW what gives the EV18SAMP14-35 a 100A advantage over the EV18S15-35?
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I think there is an error for the EV26S15-25
It says "straight neck" on the browsing page with all the torches, but on the detail page says FLEX neck...
It could be an error. 500 pages or more of website information and mistakes happen. The S indicates Straight. Will take a look at it. CK sells their connectors separately and each connector has 20 configurations it seems. Their excel file looks something like that, but as I said, it extends 5000 items just to get their relatively small line. Don't forget that many companies have 2 or 3 lines, and offer more than TIG products...What you haven't included here is that each torch can be configured with sometimes 5 different gas line configurations, then each one of those can have 10-20 connectors, some gas through dinse 25 some dinse gas through 50, some special fittings like power blocks, some tweco, some dinse 25, some dinse 50, some dinse 90(?), some with quick disconnects and each of those in a fused or unfused configuration. It's not easy and it gets just as confusing looking down a list...that is long.