Contest Spaming and Spaming

[Canada]

I get it that 60 posts is a lot of posts. Some spamer's are not very bright and leave short meaningless posts all over the site with pointless remarks like: "Good job, cool" or whatever.

The more advanced are a little more clever. Sometimes putting in quotes, etc. But apparently they do not understand time stamps. One particular poster I noticed has one post after another on a single thread 2 minutes apart between each post. No one else in between just this guy. Have I been wasting my time writing up complete thoughts and responses? Should I have been doing it over four to six posts?? If so tell me now and this puppy becomes at least two posts immediately! Heck I can be at me 60 posts in two days!

Otherwise in the spirit of fairness and integrity. Could the Everlast team rule that these obvious and unnecessary multiple spams count as only one official post? Otherwise I wasted my time and this edit could have been my fourth post on this thread.

[hooda]

nice post

[hooda]

Sorry, I couldn't resist. But seriously, 60 posts IS a lot, especially to actually put some thought into and respond intelligently. I hope the admin/mods see through that and act accordingly.

[wruehl]

Well Canada I guess I will have to respectfully disagree. I think it is perfectly acceptable to look at someone’s post about a particular thing they have built or done and simply state "Nice work guy". I know I like to hear it now and then. When I'm at a bike show I will walk up to an owner of a machine that catches my eye and say "that is a beautiful machine" and walk on. I don't need a lengthy diatribe with him to get my point across. Some things I have seen did not warrant a post because they where not overly well done IMHO, had my goal been "spamming" these posts would have been indiscriminate. I guess, in the end, I think it is ok to just give a nod to a job well done while exploring the posts for the first time. I also think that it is wise to generate some material of your own as well and let some people spam you....

[aaxiss]

I think what he's getting at is the guy just went from post to post saying "good job" or "Nice work" to increase post count quickly. The Admins will catch this guy don't worry.

[wruehl]

I think what he's getting at is the guy just went from post to post saying "good job" or "Nice work" to increase post count quickly. The Admins will catch this guy don't worry.

And my point being that I followed a similar pattern as I was going through scanning old posts on a rare "day off" from work. I don't consider that spamming as they where relevent posts, not "deep thought" but relevent none the less. It gets to be a slippery slope when we assume intent without sufficiant background. Not that we can't be suspicious, just need to hold back on the old "Blamethrower" if you will, as things are not always what they appear to be.

[Jason]

And my point being that I followed a similar pattern as I was going through scanning old posts on a rare "day off" from work. I don't consider that spamming as they where relevent posts, not "deep thought" but relevent none the less.

I agree to a point. I have gone past 60 posts and I don't find it that hard to get them if your on the forums like the Everlast team is trying to do with this contest. I agree that saying something looks nice is great but when I see these people doing it to posts that are years old and its obvious that they are only trying to pad their post count, I think its wrong and should not be considered in the contest. He also nailed the other part about multiple posts to one thread back to back. I don't remember where exactly but the Everlast team has asked that if you left something out to please use the EDIT option. This does work and I know for a fact because I have used it. Your example of saying "good job" or "nice work" may be ok if they are posted in recent threads. I wouldn't intentionally bump a 2 year thread with "good job" unless maybe I know that person is regulary on the forums. Even at that point I probably would not do it unless I had a question or simular project. Also the moderators here know what they are doing and I am sure that they do see these things and I have infact seen some of these taken care of while browsing the forum. I trust that they will make their best effort to identify those who are spamming or padding post count and not include them so that it is fair for us all.

[wruehl]

I agree to a point. I have gone past 60 posts and I don't find it that hard to get them if your on the forums like the Everlast team is trying to do with this contest. I agree that saying something looks nice is great but when I see these people doing it to posts that are years old and its obvious that they are only trying to pad their post count, I think its wrong and should not be considered in the contest. He also nailed the other part about multiple posts to one thread back to back. I don't remember where exactly but the Everlast team has asked that if you left something out to please use the EDIT option. This does work and I know for a fact because I have used it. Your example of saying "good job" or "nice work" may be ok if they are posted in recent threads. I wouldn't intentionally bump a 2 year thread with "good job" unless maybe I know that person is regulary on the forums. Even at that point I probably would not do it unless I had a question or simular project. Also the moderators here know what they are doing and I am sure that they do see these things and I have infact seen some of these taken care of while browsing the forum. I trust that they will make their best effort to identify those who are spamming or padding post count and not include them so that it is fair for us all.

Again I feel compelled to chime in. I do not agree that a time limit on a post makes a "Nice work" comment invalid or somehow "spam". I DO believe that seeing a bunch of posts on what would largely be considered a POS is "padding the post count". Since when is there a statute of limitations on quality work? Did you see the car and trailer that guy fabricated from raw material? Is that any less relevent or cool today? I hope not, at least the author knows I still believe its good work. Are we saying that new commers should not search the archives and explore? Or that they should just do it in silence? I could sit and argue that "if you have not posted your own work, or your own projects your just feeding off of the list chatter to build up post count" but I don't agree with that statement either. I DID spend a quiet raniey afternoon mousing through the projects posts, and where I felt compelled to leave a comment, I did, all the way through to the LAST post. Did I do that with the TIG Welder post? No, frankly it was not as interesting to me. I might use the search tool to nail technical posts buried deep and not wade through every post on the site. The point being that looking at the work of others, no matter how old, is entertaining to me, and others I'm sure, and I will continue to comment on things that I think really stand out and deserve recognition, no matter how old, or new. I'll put my soap box away now....Peace!

[dgarnier]

If there wasnt a contest going on - would you have paged back 2 years looking for posts to make good job comments on, if not then they are spam postings. No that you have gotten to 60 post are you still going back an making the good job posts?

[Zoomie]

I'd also like to chime in. I search, find and sometimes comment. I rarely look at the date because I'm interested in the content, and well, everything (posts) were old! I agree that there are some hollow posts on here now. I must say though if it gets folks to communicate, I'm good with it. When I first got here I was welcomed by a number of folks even though I was asking the same questions others had asked previously. It is/was about starting a dialog! I was also suprised at how slow the board was. Nobody really communicated much, and resurecting old threads seemed to be the only way to get folks talking. Mark, Mike and Ray have a ton of info on these machines, the processes and stuff they've made and done. I want to pump that knowledge out of thier heads as well as alot of other do'ers here. I'm glad the days of it only being a gripe board appear over. Ramblage complete.

[hooda]

OK, First let me thank wruehl, for introducing me to a new term. I hereby declare "blamethrower" to be the latest word that I shall add to my vernacular and use on a daily basis. (I wish there was a thumbs-up guy in the smiley section.) Next let me say that this is a really good, thought-provoking thread. Let's take a close look at direct quotes from the rules for the contest.
"Any entrant making bogus or spamming posts to increase or “up” his/her post count will be disqualified. Any entrant having his posts removed by the moderator due to discourteous or inappropriate comments will also be disqualified."

Nowhere do I see a clear definition of "spamming", but as a guy of average intelligence, I know what it is. That same average intelligence now has me genuinely concerned, as I have given one-liners, sometimes due to time constraints, including once in this thread, but I thought it was truly funny. I hope that by "will be disqualified" they refer to the individual post, not the entire entrant, unless said entrant is only engaged in that type of behavior. If they were to disqualify every entrant based on that rule, then the majority of entrants are already out of the game (yes, I actually spend a good amount of time on this forum, and no, most of us are not perfect).

"Entrants are strongly encouraged to start threads of interest that they think are a value to others and post helpful and relevant information in existing threads as well."

I would hope that this includes commentary, and questions on older threads as well, one of the people posting on this thread resurrected a thread on Mark's Bar B QUE that had been dead for 10 months. In spite of the fact that it was old, it was great info on a really neat project that has inspired me to re-start a project that I have had laying dormant for years. A new thread could have been started, but hey, quality of content was already there.


"General chat posts concerning any activity, especially welding, discussion of other products or work related are welcome as well."

This would lead one to believe that it should be ok to give feedback on a particular subject no matter how eloquent one happens to be. Also to start threads relevant to whatever interests one. This would encourage one to become more engaged in this forum, which I believe is the whole point of this exercise.

So, there's my take on it, I hope the mods/admin clarify things a little, as I am concerned a little on how this will shake out. I convinced my brother to join this forum and as of today, he has 48 freaking posts to go in the next 2 weeks or so to qualify. I gave him a ration of u-know-what and he promised me he'd get r done, but the guy works his behind off, so I'm sure he would want to know what the criteria are, so he doesn't waste his time.
I still think this is one of the best contests I have seen in a long time, and I can see that the primary goal is to grow this forum and to expand the reach of the EVERLAST line of products. The size of the pool of contestants is really pretty small for such a sizable prize, and I would like to win as much as the next guy. I really do trust that the moderators will clarify this for all of us.

[wruehl]

If there wasnt a contest going on - would you have paged back 2 years looking for posts to make good job comments on, if not then they are spam postings. No that you have gotten to 60 post are you still going back an making the good job posts?

Well had you taken the time to READ the words I wrote and potentially comprehend them you would have noted that I went through the posts to the end. Why would I go back now? Your comments are less meritus than any "nice job" remark I've seen yet.

[aaxiss]

It's not that we are saying that a reply to a thread of "nice work" if spamming , but 10 of the like in 5 mins is. If you have to go back 5 months to say "good job" than you're there for one reason only, to bump that count.

If I found an older post like that that truly had some nice work and i felt compelled to compliment someone, I sure as hell wouldn't belittle them or their work with " good job" or "nice work" only. I would or could use those words but I would most likely use them as part of a sentence like...

" Great job Roberto, how long did it take you to complete that?, and how did you form that angle with such thick material."

For example I get spammed all day long in real life , Most people have never seen a wheelchair with suspension, with a bright yellow frame and red rock shox it does stand out but when people in passing say "nice wheelchair man" without stopping for any further dialogue, I think them Idiots because if they were genuinely interested they would have stopped and initiated a conversation, or at least added to why it's such a nice wheelchair... Nice wheelchair man. never seen shocks on one before. Can That jump off curbs?"


You get the point, Basically if you go to more than a post a min, saying good job or nice work than plain an simple your just upping your post count spamming it up. because if you really thought something was so nice would you really not feel kind low telling someone the same thing you use on your kid when he does something that your genuinely not interested in but say anything that you think will quiet them down. "look dad, i caught a grasshopper" ..... "nice work son" You climb back under the car and continue to work on it with no further thought of the kid nor the bug.

If you don't have the time to type more than 2 words on a post why type at all, I myself find those kind or reply's insulting. Next time your wife says " Hey babe I just got back from the salon, how do you like my hair"..... See how far " Nice job" get's ya ROFL

[performance]

We did warn against it. We can't read every single post every one makes and keep up with it. I think I specifically said, posting a bunch of "looks good" or " nice job" isn't considered legitimate. We have been lenient though. A few posts like that won't hurt, and when used in the correct situation, is fine. But digging up 2 year old posts to make that comment isn't. Apparently not everyone reads the same rules and instructions that I do.

[Canada]

I suppose I wasn't as clear as I should have been or maybe I was just way off. Sometimes a quick "that a boy" is fine. But a pattern of a one liner after another is very very suspect. I know the short replies was discussed in another thread but I couldn't find it to add my thoughts. The Everlast team did indicate that they will disallow any obvious spaming, but as they and some of you have pointed out it is not always easy to spot. It was the blatant spamer that caught my eye. In one thread three posts two minutes after each other! That was post a reply then begin again right away. Come on that is intentional spaming.

I am shooting hard for 60 posts too. I will probably hit 59 due to my exceptional math skills. I think the bulk of you guys are crazy nuts, a lot of fun and some pretty impressive talent too. I am going to stay on after the contest. Birds of a feather I suppose. (The first two for sure!)

So to stop all this silliness I suggest we award me the money. The pressure is off and EVERYBODY IS HAPPY! There is nothing better than a popular win! It must be in by character .... I just give and give.....metal please!

[performance]

We hope EVERYONE will continue to stay around. That's the point of the contest. But I am sure we will have another follow up to this one. To think....I talked them down from 75 posts.

[wruehl]

It's not that we are saying that a reply to a thread of "nice work" if spamming , but 10 of the like in 5 mins is. If you have to go back 5 months to say "good job" than you're there for one reason only, to bump that count.

If I found an older post like that that truly had some nice work and i felt compelled to compliment someone, I sure as hell wouldn't belittle them or their work with " good job" or "nice work" only. I would or could use those words but I would most likely use them as part of a sentence like...

" Great job Roberto, how long did it take you to complete that?, and how did you form that angle with such thick material."

For example I get spammed all day long in real life , Most people have never seen a wheelchair with suspension, with a bright yellow frame and red rock shox it does stand out but when people in passing say "nice wheelchair man" without stopping for any further dialogue, I think them Idiots because if they were genuinely interested they would have stopped and initiated a conversation, or at least added to why it's such a nice wheelchair... Nice wheelchair man. never seen shocks on one before. Can That jump off curbs?"


You get the point, Basically if you go to more than a post a min, saying good job or nice work than plain an simple your just upping your post count spamming it up. because if you really thought something was so nice would you really not feel kind low telling someone the same thing you use on your kid when he does something that your genuinely not interested in but say anything that you think will quiet them down. "look dad, i caught a grasshopper" ..... "nice work son" You climb back under the car and continue to work on it with no further thought of the kid nor the bug.

If you don't have the time to type more than 2 words on a post why type at all, I myself find those kind or reply's insulting. Next time your wife says " Hey babe I just got back from the salon, how do you like my hair"..... See how far " Nice job" get's ya ROFL

And still I disagree,
By your reasoning "a simple compliment" = spamming BUT "a simple compliment + inquiry" does not. This notion is ridiculous. I get comments all the time, "Nice Bike", "Sweet ride" typically from males (the women just wink and smile). I make the same remarks when I feel compelled. I do not sit in judgment of the commenter when receiving them, I graciously accept them, sometimes with a simple two word response "Thank you" or maybe just a nod and a smile. Do I feel cheated that the person did not inquire where I had my custom seat work done? Hell no, THESE ARE SHORTHAND CONVERSATIONS BETWEEN MEN! we DO NOT NEED EXCESSIVE DIALOG to feel accepted or appreciated. Now and then a person may approach and tell me how dangerous motorcycling is and stand there and try and "educate" me about their sisters, brothers, dentists friend who was crippled or killed on a motorcycle. I should value this dialog more? I think not. Now the timing issue has been parroted over and over. IF YOU ARE NEW TO THE FORUM it SHOULD be OK to thumb through the older posts as WE WHERE NOT HERE WHEN THEY WHERE MADE! As I said before this does NOT make the comment less genuine, IF THE POSTER is making irrelevant comments about a given post, then I'm with the lynch mob, heck I'll bring the rope. I work a lot, long hours, sometimes weeks between a day off, and when I had sufficient opportunity to dig into the archives I did, when I saw something that caught my eye I left a simple comment, plain and simple, no apologies.
I find your last sentence very telling, you basicly create and analog between yourself and the fairer sex by stating that both you and the woman in question would be offended the same way, many of us simply are not, nor are our bug finding children...

[performance]

Lets just keep things civil and agree to the basics of the contest. Try not to resurrect OLD threads more than a year UNLESS there is something worthwhile to contribute additionally. IF you have a legitimate question about a topic that isnt already covered, ask it by starting a new one...But research it first and keep adding to your knowledge base. We can all act like gentlemen or not. I prefer the honor system and have tried overall to allow some spirit of generosity in the posts on the forum, but I have nixed a few as well just to tap the brakes. Me, Mike, Oleg and Ray work in this forum, and we can take care of serious abuse here. We want spirited, live debate, and serious forum posts. Having to narrowly define things further takes the fun and life out of posting for all of us. Again, a gentleman's agreement to be civil, reputable, and honoring the rules stated is the best approach. The rules are quite clear and the comments I have made about the type posts not wanted are too whether people agree or not. Its a contest and contests have rules. I can't watch every post, nor do I want to, so please don't make me.

[Ram48]

The contest is run by Everlast and the prize of $1800 worth of machinery is is unbelievable, They made the contest, put up the prize and, I am certain will see that the winner did in fact abide by those rules, I don't think any one from Everlast has to police the posts that is not until they pick the winner then all they need to do is look at the count and content of that one member to determine if in their judgment he or she has met the spirit of the rules if they did they win if not pick another name and check that one until someone meets the requirements. No need to post anyone's name but that of the first person picked that complied with the rules. That is fair simple and I hope will stop this bickering, which by the way has added to some folks post count lol
Ray

[Ray]

What Ram said.