256 a bit of trouble

[ducksface]

My new 256 stick welds like perfection. We are trying to use the plasma torch and are having problems. torch comes on by itself and will not turn off. Once we shut off the machine to get the torch to quit, I get LOTS of smoke from inside the unit. Smoke does not appear to be damaging anything. Torch cuts fine, just comes on by itself both fire and air, won't turn off and the machine smokes like a smoke machine.

It turned itself on while the torch was laying on a piece of carpet....


Suggestions please. We are at;
30 amps or less settings
65 pounds of air
good flow
Positive ground.

[sportbike]

Did you try the tig weld function yet?

The torch switch isn't somehow stuck on is it? That may explain the auto on, but not the smoke.

Try to catch all of the smoke in a bag. If you figure out what the issue is, and get it to stop smoking, you might be able to put the smoke from eh bag back it. :-)

[ducksface]

We tried stick welding again it still works fine. Switched back to plasma and we now have a high frequency arc that I can see through the front louvers, just to the left of center when facing the machine. We got a picture then turned the machine off. No smoke, but no plasma either.

We'll try the tig now....

[bigjoeinkg]

Check the contact points. Seems that Jody (weldingtipsandtricks) has a problem with his 256.

[ducksface]

tig works fine. I still have the high frequency spark inside the nmachine though. It stops once the tig strikes and arc, comes back the moment the torch arc quits.


So problem is with plasma maybe, going to try it again right now.

[ducksface]

Checked the plasma again. It works fine, still have high frequency spark in the box that goes away when an arc is lit, still turns itself on. Less smoke, but still smokes internally. Torch seems to get a little hotter than expected. Consumables look horrible, we'll blame technique [our lack thereof] for the consumables.

My non-expert diagnosis;
Bad switch in plasma torch keeping it turned on
One set of points needs adjusted.
Smoking...I don't know.

[performance]

Ducksface,

Smoke is not normal. Do not continue to use it until we figure out the source of it. It could be a wire has rubbed against the case, as there are some tight areas. Please remove the cover AFTER unplugging it. Just remove the screws in the back panel, and main cover. Remove cover by lifting and pulling toward the rear simultaneously. You'll need to flex the cover slightly to pull it off.

Which torch do you have? Is it the P 80? Do you have it in 2t or 4t?

The HF should NOT stay on after the tig torch quits. Unless a switch is stuck closed somewhere. We need to discuss this on the phone. As it is late, and tomorrow a holiday, you are welcome to call me at your convenience if need be, and leave a message, and I'll get back with you as soon as I can do so.

[ducksface]

Gentlemen;

The post below this is absolute proof of the most solid customer service you will find in any industry. It's a Saturday, and the eve of one of the most importnat holiday of the year for families, and look what happens when I have a slight problem. Service to the rescue. How could anyone be unhappy with such service. I'll call you on Tuesday, Monday is gonna suck for you because of the deliveries and the holiday. Thanks for checking the forum.

Happy Holiday.

[performance]

If you'd like just go ahead and take a look at the interior and isolate the source of the smoke if possible. Send me some pics of the problem area so we have a good idea where to start. I must confess this is a new one on me. I don't mind helping this weekend. Its a holiday, and no family is close by so I will be stuck around the house after the mornings activities. I think Ray had one the torch would not shut off on, but its not a common. In your case, it may not be the torch. Again, please advise to which torch you got. We can possibly get you up and running if its a wire grounding out against the case. If not we'll take a look deeper.

[Ray]

Duckface,
Normally I would say smoke is certainly bad news, HOWEVER in this case it’s actually not an issue. I’ve had several multi process units doing that for a while then it will quit.
There are some large white ceramic resistors on the right side of the machine, used in the plasma function, they use a white adhesive compound, to hold down some of the components and seal some connections, it’s been finding it’s way onto the resistors and smokes until it fries off.
As far as the torch you may want to check the connector at the plug.
If you want to give me a call we can check it real quick.
Ext. 207.

[ducksface]

I'm fine. The smoke is not the normal acrid smoke you would expect, it does smell like a vinyl base adhesive of some sort. Slightest of insulation smell, almost no smell at all. it is very fine particulate, far finer than an insulation fire, not roping black smoke, more like a fog [gray] machine, but wispy.

I'll give you a call Tuesday or so. Everything worked when shut it off and then retested, I'm sure it will work when we get together on the phone. I'll go take a look at the torch and report back to give you a head start. I'll open it tomorrow and have pics ready of anything I find.
I only started this thread so others won't freak out if the new shipment [I appear to be the first to get one from the new shipment]uses an odd adhesive or a bit of insulation was cut too long/short.

If I wasn't so aquainted with starting little fires, and thusly a connoisseur of acrid smells, I might have freaked out a bit. I am unconcerned. It'll heal itself, or customer service will heal it for me.

[ducksface]

Torch says A81 on it. Red torch, trigger orange, trigger locks [each side] yellow.

[performance]

The A 81 should NOT have any troubles. Its genuine trafimet. Its not out of the realm of possibility, but it is not a prime candidate for trouble. Did you say the HF resumed after the TIG arc went out? Does it stay on continuously?

[Jason]

I had a weird problem right when I went to use my new unit. I was using TIG and the first arc I tried to start made the unit start buzzing pretty loud and the voltage gauge was all the place up into the 600's and had an orange light on. I shut it off and on 3 or 4 times and it finally quit. I did notice that if my torch is a little warm or after I welded a seam or two I had problems getting the arc to start. The unit did work to weld my new exhaust for my car and only had a hard time getting arc starts. I was using 16ga 304 stainless.

[Ole Sarge]

I have one of the new 256's, I have worked for years on Uninteruptable Power Supplies, use similar parts, IGBT's and such. Smoke is not cool, I may pull my covers before I fire it up as I am not big on melting parts or insulation. I would suggest that if you run yours with the cover off, do not insert nose for a better look/sniff, the big bang could hurt your feelings and face/sniffer.

[ducksface]

OK, almost exactly 30 days later, all is well.
Here's how it went;
Ray, Mike Alex and Oleg all worked on this for me.
I opened the unit and it was obvious what was smoking; It was residue on a HUGE resistor [like Mallory used to issue with their coils] and was really no big deal.
The buzzing was the points going wild the moment I turned on the unit. With a bit of tracking we found what we think is the problem; a tiny standard 12volt relay seems to have welded its contacts together. This causes the machine to Always be on. The torch would be on no matter what, the points roared at about 30 cycle a second, and the damn thing tig'd just fine. Once the arc caught the points would close and all was well. Break away, and the points would rattle.
You better have a grip on the plasma torch when you turned on the machine; machine-gun points then wham, it came on no matter what you were doing.

All because of a standard little bitty relay. Relay is right on top, in the center of the top board. I could whack it with a screwdriver, but the soldering on those boards is far too good for me to R&R it.

So;

Every time I emailed about a previous convewrsation someone called me within 3 minutes. They embarrassed me with such good service. A bazillion parts in a 256, I wasn't even angry that this stupid relay welded itself together.
Mike called me about midnight his time, Ray was always there, Alex called just to see what was up. Every one of them offered me all they could, except for a different welder. No 256 available and all on the boat are spoken for.
So... Oleg finds a way. Someone on the other end of the world is swapping his new 256 for separate units. Swap guy [thanks to him and Crystal for getting this done] ships me his unit, which has been fully tested and ran and actually used to ensure it works, and I mailed mine to the service center.

What a difference in machines.

All is well, Oleg is treating me right on a cooler [so is Mike and Alex. I need to work them seperately, together 8-)], they're reimbursing me for the shipping [I had a FedEx account so I just took the bull by the horns and got it handled], swap guy gets what he wants, I got what I wanted.

From what I read on the forum I guess I got the only bad one out of the shipment. I'm happy overall, and will buy my MIG from them when it's time.

You'd think since I had a month to just hang around I'd have projects cut and fitted. I haven't done squat.

[ducksface]

I had a weird problem right when I went to use my new unit. I was using TIG and the first arc I tried to start made the unit start buzzing pretty loud and the voltage gauge was all the place up into the 600's and had an orange light on. I shut it off and on 3 or 4 times and it finally quit. I did notice that if my torch is a little warm or after I welded a seam or two I had problems getting the arc to start. The unit did work to weld my new exhaust for my car and only had a hard time getting arc starts. I was using 16ga 304 stainless.

Sounds about like mine. I guess your relay healed itself as relays often do. Same thing, light on, torch was warm because there was no post flow {I had to kill mine on the main breaker}.