Attn: All 250/320 ext owners must read!

[performance]

No, DVA not true, you may have misunderstood. It will be smaller than the current 250 EXT, maybe slightly larger than the EX. We posted pictures here of it, so you can see it. I know its hard to get a relative comparison from the picture, but it's not as big.

[redbeard]

What is the "VRG" (if my eyes are seeing that right) stick mode?

Hate to shoot holes in the "intuitiveness" of the panel right off the bat, but regarding the AC balance, the panel graphic contradicts itself. Will the number displayed match the wording of "CLEAN(%)" i.e. EP% or will it be the EN% as depicted by the LED/arrow in the negative half of the wave?

I do hope the testing includes a thorough check to make sure that the programming matches the user interface. That was one of the things on the original machine that caused me, as a TIG n00b especially, a great deal of confusion and frustration.

[jakeru]

Congrats - this is encouraging news for what will become the new "flagship" Everlast TIG machine!

Like Mike said, I feel like there is actually a *lot* you did right on the 250EXT, and I hope the new factory will be much more accommodating than it seems like the old one was. If so, you definitely made the right decision to "dump" the old factory.

The starting point of the overall machine and user interface is looking really sweet - congrats to Mark, or whoever else is responsible. That said, I hope it's not too late to solicit feedback on the specs and design for this new machine. With that said, here is my wishlist:

1. Too bad you can't do independent amplitude control like the 250EXT, but the four different waveforms are a great start. (Could you make at least one of those options, or give an option to provide binary "unbalanced" waveform that would give, say, 30% or so more current on the EN side than the EP side, for providing the bulk of the useful benefit that independent amplitude controls of the 250EXT would provide?)

2. The cooling system should be designed for low DB operation. (Consider using different/better/"more aerodynamic" fan blades, such as those found in my Super200P, or other quiet fan blade designs I've seen. Picture available on request).

3. You haven't mentioned duty cycle specs, but I think it almost goes without saying, that the machine should support at least as much as the 250EX and 250EXT (60% @ 250 amps).

4. The starting circuit should be reliable, and support a wide range of conditions, including low AC amps settings (I think if you are going to borrow the transistor-based starting circuit of the 210EXT, it will help!)

5. The AC balance adjustment limit should be "ample" toward low EP% end (or high EN%) - at least 90% EN, like the 250EX, but preferably allow even more extreme settings. (Like something in the neighborhood of 95-99% EN.) If it helps reduce costs at all (or trade for other more desirable features), consider dropping some of the range offered toward the high EP% settings. Anything above ~60% EP is of very little value.

6. The "out of the box" AC balance setting should be optimized for being a good general purpose aluminum welding settings. (In particular it should not be 50%, because this is not a very useful setting.) Rather, it should probably be somewhere more along the lines of say, 30% EP, for taking the heat off a smaller diameter tungsten.)

7. Would be nice to have an increased max amp output beyond 250, (such as the ability to output around 280-300 amps peak, which the 250EXT could do in AC mode by using the amplitude control to boost EN). Basically, boosting it as high as you can practically and reliably off of 240V 1-phase operation (even if at a reduced duty cycle) would be extremely desirable. This would allow us to more quickly puddle (and satisfactority weld) large and thick weldments (especially aluminum) while using inexpensive, pure argon.

8. The AC balance units should be made more harmonious with the non-EXT Everlast machines, by specifying the AC balance in straightforward "%EP" units (rather than the funky "+/-% from 50%EP" units used in the first generation EXTs.)

9. Give us much pulse frequency and AC frequency adjustment range to play with as you can within reason (without adding a lot to the cost.)

10. A switched plug for the water cooler, that automatically turns the cooler on/off when needed (such as, in tandem to whenever the 255EXT machine is switched on/off) will add value by helping us to avoid damaging our watercooled leads by forgetting to turn on our coolers (and, potentially save you guys $ on some warranty repair headaches as well!)

12. An on/off switch that is conveniently located on the front of the machine is more convenient to access than on the back, so consider putting one on the front.

12. A reprogrammable or replaceable chip, to allow aftermarket software/firmware upgrades, could potentially add a lot of longer-term value to the machine too.

13. Good quality accessories are going to be a nice touch, especially a good quality footpedal (and from what I've heard the 210EXT footpedal seems like it may have been a winner, so you might consider using the exact same one). On the torch, I'd recommend using a slim, conventional (non-euro) handle, like you did on the 250EXT with its flex-neck WP-20 (which actually looked like a really great setup). Silicone rubber ("superflex" style) welding leads on the TIG torch, a brass ground clamp, etc. could be a really nice value-adding touches.

Hope this helps you guys. Cheers and keep up the good work!

[Rambozo]

What is the "VRG" (if my eyes are seeing that right) stick mode?

Hate to shoot holes in the "intuitiveness" of the panel right off the bat, but regarding the AC balance, the panel graphic contradicts itself. Will the number displayed match the wording of "CLEAN(%)" i.e. EP% or will it be the EN% as depicted by the LED/arrow in the negative half of the wave?

I do hope the testing includes a thorough check to make sure that the programming matches the user interface. That was one of the things on the original machine that caused me, as a TIG n00b especially, a great deal of confusion and frustration.

VRD = Voltage Reduction Device, lowers voltage for open circuit when stick welding. A safety feature required in some places.

Agreed the graphic and wording do not match that well for AC balance. Should be an easy fix with a different printing, or LED relocation.

I am curious about the "easy setup" for AC and DC. Perhaps that will be something that takes care of TIG n00bs.

[performance]

Jakeru, you just added a grand to the cost of the machine! Overall the basic design and parameters are going to closely match the EX/EXT units.

The cooling system will not change. It is still the same High Output fan design we use on all our units. It's not as much an issue with an improper blade design. It is aggressive to move a lot of air. This isn't your laptop with a low volume fan. You ask for duty cycle, we give it. But we have to give it around a design that works for us.

We have deleted the water flow function sensor on the unit. It is a cost item and an extra circuit to give issue. IF you want to prevent damage, simply use a fuseable lead. It is likely we can wire the plug to switch on but... This is a minor issue and the responsibility of the customer to manage the flow. Any damage resulting from not turning the cooler on is the operator's fault as it is and not part of the warranty.
The switch will not be added on the front. The plastic molds are cast. It is VERY expensive to make any changes to the mold. There was not enough room as it was.

The pulse and AC frequency range will be oriented around practicality and stability of the unit and not wild extremes that are of limited value.

The output is going to be 250 amps. That is the practical "target" limit we are shooting for in this unit on single phase. It's a range that works for us in our sales figures. If you need more, the 320 EXT is available now.

The super flex and all that stuff will be available as an additional purchase as of now.

We made the decision to drop the amplitude off of a variety of inputs. I did not agree with it, but it is gone. The basic features are already in development, so we are not able to make much changes at this point.

[performance]

The function on AC still adjusts cleaning, regardless of the orientation. The % is in () which states it's function It still adjusts percent, likely the same as the previous EXT's. It was reviewed heavily by respected welding industry pros and they felt it was fine. We may change it, but we are at a stage where it won't affect operation or testing. Personally, I feel if you adjust the negative more negative or positive more positive, that is sort of self explanatory.

[DVA]

No, DVA not true, you may have misunderstood. It will be smaller than the current 250 EXT, maybe slightly larger than the EX. We posted pictures here of it, so you can see it. I know its hard to get a relative comparison from the picture, but it's not as big.

I must have misunderstood our conversation. I thought you were saying the 255 EXT would be larger than the 250 EXT. That is nice that it is a smaller package.

[DVA]

Jakeru, you just added a grand to the cost of the machine! Overall the basic design and parameters are going to closely match the EX/EXT units.

The cooling system will not change. It is still the same High Output fan design we use on all our units. It's not as much an issue with an improper blade design. It is aggressive to move a lot of air. This isn't your laptop with a low volume fan. You ask for duty cycle, we give it. But we have to give it around a design that works for us.

We have deleted the water flow function sensor on the unit. It is a cost item and an extra circuit to give issue. IF you want to prevent damage, simply use a fuseable lead. It is likely we can wire the plug to switch on but... This is a minor issue and the responsibility of the customer to manage the flow. Any damage resulting from not turning the cooler on is the operator's fault as it is and not part of the warranty.
The switch will not be added on the front. The plastic molds are cast. It is VERY expensive to make any changes to the mold. There was not enough room as it was.

The pulse and AC frequency range will be oriented around practicality and stability of the unit and not wild extremes that are of limited value.

The output is going to be 250 amps. That is the practical "target" limit we are shooting for in this unit on single phase. It's a range that works for us in our sales figures. If you need more, the 320 EXT is available now.

The super flex and all that stuff will be available as an additional purchase as of now.

We made the decision to drop the amplitude off of a variety of inputs. I did not agree with it, but it is gone. The basic features are already in development, so we are not able to make much changes at this point.

What about high frequency start? Will the machine have a HF startup like the 250 EX or the more robust design like the 250 EXT?

[jakeru]

Thanks for reading and considering my "wish list", Mark, and for some additional info on some of the specifics. Obviously, with the prototype already constructed, and a timeframe already set just a few months away, I wasn't expecting you to make any major changes. However, please at least file the wish list away for the next version of machine (if and when that happens) after the 255EXT.

Regarding the cooling fans, you imply that noisy fans are necessary for high duty cycle, however this is not the case. Case in point: my 2007 Everlast Super200P achieves 200amps @ 60% duty cycle with two relatively small fans (about 4.5" diameter for the rotating assemblies) which are not that loud, yet (subjectively) seem to move a lot of airflow and pressure. I wonder if they do this by having better blade aerodynamics than the fan currently being used in your IGBT machines. In case you want to do further investigation, here is a picture with their manufacturer and part number listed:


Also, a while ago, I picked up a surplus 240V "comair rotron" fan with very impressive airflow and pressure output, that I have used to bring my air compressor up from a rather pathetic performance up to a reliable, full 100% duty cycle. The diameter of the fan blades is about 5.75", and the overall dimensions are about 6"x6.25"x2". It also seem pretty efficient for how loud it is for how much air it moves. Let me know if more info about it would be useful.

[redbeard]

Jakeru, you just added a grand to the cost of the machine!

Not to mention a year to the schedule! It will be bad enough being TIGless for as long as the exchange will take as it is.

The function on AC still adjusts cleaning, regardless of the orientation. The % is in () which states it's function It still adjusts percent, likely the same as the previous EXT's. It was reviewed heavily by respected welding industry pros and they felt it was fine. We may change it, but we are at a stage where it won't affect operation or testing. Personally, I feel if you adjust the negative more negative or positive more positive, that is sort of self explanatory.

I personally don't have a problem with referencing the AC balance from whatever point you want: EP%, EN% or 50+/-%, AS LONG AS THE GRAPHIC MATCHES THE PROGRAMMING. The way it is now with the dimension arrows defining the EN portion of the cycle, I interpret that as "EN=x% of the period." Seeing a negative number in that context throws my brain into WTF mode sucking all the intuitiveness right out. I'm sure the pros who use this every day will easily adapt to the machine and won't even notice after a day or two, but like it or not, many of your customers are n00bs and weekend welders who will benefit greatly if the graphic accurately represents the waveform settings.

[Rambozo]

Not to mention a year to the schedule! It will be bad enough being TIGless for as long as the exchange will take as it is.



I personally don't have a problem with referencing the AC balance from whatever point you want: EP%, EN% or 50+/-%, AS LONG AS THE GRAPHIC MATCHES THE PROGRAMMING. The way it is now with the dimension arrows defining the EN portion of the cycle, I interpret that as "EN=x% of the period." Seeing a negative number in that context throws my brain into WTF mode sucking all the intuitiveness right out. I'm sure the pros who use this every day will easily adapt to the machine and won't even notice after a day or two, but like it or not, many of your customers are n00bs and weekend welders who will benefit greatly if the graphic accurately represents the waveform settings.

It is kinda arbitrary and one of the things that varies from brand to brand, so I personally don't care one way or the other. While Miller now does theirs as % NEG and Everlast does % POS it's all the same in the end. I can't say I'm a huge fan of the 50% +/- system used on the 210EXT, but it's really not an issue. Maybe if you had a shop full of different brands it might be nice to have a standard, but really it's no big deal. The early Syncrowave had a knob that went from Max Cleaning to Max Penetration with an arbitrary 1- 10 scale and number 3 was marked Balanced.

What you're saying is you would rather have something like this?



Or this?

[performance]

What about high frequency start? Will the machine have a HF startup like the 250 EX or the more robust design like the 250 EXT?

The 250 EX has been changed as well so it isn't the same type points being used and should be being phased in.

[todmorg]

Jakeru, you just added a grand to the cost of the machine! Overall the basic design and parameters are going to closely match the EX/EXT units.

The cooling system will not change. It is still the same High Output fan design we use on all our units. It's not as much an issue with an improper blade design. It is aggressive to move a lot of air. This isn't your laptop with a low volume fan. You ask for duty cycle, we give it. But we have to give it around a design that works for us.

We have deleted the water flow function sensor on the unit. It is a cost item and an extra circuit to give issue. IF you want to prevent damage, simply use a fuseable lead. It is likely we can wire the plug to switch on but... This is a minor issue and the responsibility of the customer to manage the flow. Any damage resulting from not turning the cooler on is the operator's fault as it is and not part of the warranty.
The switch will not be added on the front. The plastic molds are cast. It is VERY expensive to make any changes to the mold. There was not enough room as it was.

The pulse and AC frequency range will be oriented around practicality and stability of the unit and not wild extremes that are of limited value.

The output is going to be 250 amps. That is the practical "target" limit we are shooting for in this unit on single phase. It's a range that works for us in our sales figures. If you need more, the 320 EXT is available now.

The super flex and all that stuff will be available as an additional purchase as of now.

We made the decision to drop the amplitude off of a variety of inputs. I did not agree with it, but it is gone. The basic features are already in development, so we are not able to make much changes at this point.

Mark, a very good, well thought out wish list was presented, defensive replies like " This is a minor issue and the responsibility of the customer to manage the flow. Any damage resulting from not turning the cooler on is the operator's fault as it is and not part of the warranty. " are very abrasive and will only cause friction.

The built in water flow protection was a great feature on the 250EXT, I hate to see it go.
Air noise is another issue that probably could have been addressed in a complete new design, instead of trying to convince people that large air volumes have to produce large noise.

Todd

[DVA]

Mark, a very good, well thought out wish list was presented, defensive replies like " This is a minor issue and the responsibility of the customer to manage the flow. Any damage resulting from not turning the cooler on is the operator's fault as it is and not part of the warranty. " are very abrasive and will only cause friction.

The built in water flow protection was a great feature on the 250EXT, I hate to see it go.
Air noise is another issue that probably could have been addressed in a complete new design, instead of trying to convince people that large air volumes have to produce large noise.

Todd

So, what are you going to do with your 250 EXT?

[CGCINC]

The 250 EX has been changed as well so it isn't the same type points being used and should be being phased in.

So will there be a kit you guys sell to change the older model 250EX points to the newer type system?

[performance]

So will there be a kit you guys sell to change the older model 250EX points to the newer type system?

Honestly, I am not sure if they are 100% compatable with old style. Any kit would require some soldering.

[todmorg]

So, what are you going to do with your 250 EXT?

I'm not sure yet, I'm sending the 250EXT back, but I'm going to have to hear a few more good things about the 255EXT before I decide to try it.

Todd

[DVA]

I'm not sure yet, I'm sending the 250EXT back, but I'm going to have to hear a few more good things about the 255EXT before I decide to try it.

Todd

I am going to ship my 250 EXT back and go with the 2550 EXT.

I was told by Oleg that the 255 EXT will take a range of pots from different foot petals 5K,10k,20k…, as the new welder has built in electronics to adjust for the different pots. This is a cool feature if it works well. The main issue will be rewiring a foot petal to accommodate the Everlast plug.

[Rambozo]

The main issue will be rewiring a foot petal to accommodate the Everlast plug.

Or perhaps a wireless receiver plug?

[Gwaltnak]

I called today to setup my return of the 250EXT, but no call back. Hoping to get this done ASAP! Really excited about the 255EXT!!!