spot welding with my PowerTIG 230EX

[nikstiks]

Hi guys just wondering whats the process for spot welding with my PowerTIG 230EX unit?

cheers,
Niko.

[performance]

Process? Not sure of the question. It's designed for TIG.

[nikstiks]

Hi Mark, I haven't used this unit yet and want to spot weld (not using filler rod) like this below. Restoring an old vw split screen bus.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-LSuFsqoWc

[piopio]

all he is doing is turning the amps way up for the gauge of material.the fancy cup isnt essential to the process

[Rambozo]

The spot timer will be perfect for that. Just make sure you have both panels clamped tightly together.

[nikstiks]

thanks guys I'll give it a go soon,
cheers,
niko.

[Gearhead51]

FYI, automotive repair spot welders, are often capable of putting out 10,000 plus amps, have over 1000 lbs of compressive force at the weld point, and normally does a 6mm weld "nugget". The proper testing of a spot weld in the automotive industry is a "tear out" where the weld is torn apart. If the "nugget" stays in tact and the metals tear around it, it is a successful weld. These are often done on scrap panels that have been removed from the damaged area of the car. I don't know if that information is helpful to you or not. I just don't want somebody trying to put a car together using this method if it does not actually offer proper penetration. After training technicians on direct resistance spot welders, I see a few reasons why I wouldn't trust this method until I attempted a tear out.

[performance]

FYI, automotive repair spot welders, are often capable of putting out 10,000 plus amps, have over 1000 lbs of compressive force at the weld point, and normally does a 6mm weld "nugget". The proper testing of a spot weld in the automotive industry is a "tear out" where the weld is torn apart. If the "nugget" stays in tact and the metals tear around it, it is a successful weld. These are often done on scrap panels that have been removed from the damaged area of the car. I don't know if that information is helpful to you or not. I just don't want somebody trying to put a car together using this method if it does not actually offer proper penetration. After training technicians on direct resistance spot welders, I see a few reasons why I wouldn't trust this method until I attempted a tear out.

Tig spot welding is different in many ways, and your point is a little off. It's frequently and safely done in the industry in many applications. You have a shielding gas for one and the time used is up to 10 seconds. It's NO different than a normal weld. A tig welded spot weld will be stronger than an unshielded resistance spot weld anyday. The fusion starts on the start plate and penetrates fully down to the second plate. The resistance spot weld is made between the two pieces and is typically smaller and with less penetration. Properly clamped as Rambozo said, you cna use the spot weld timer to make a nice spot weld....and forget about "tear outs" because the only thing tearing IS the metal around it.

Any good set of clamps provides plenty of clamping force to make a good spot weld.

[Gearhead51]

Mark,

Sorry for being off point. I was just relaying the proper Icar (http://www.i-car.com/) and insurance industry recognized method for spot welding and recommending a testing procedure. Being in the industry and training proper vehicle repair, I wanted to make sure somebody doesn't have a car that rolls down the road then "unzips" in an accident. Resistance welding doesn't need a shielding gas, and is one of the only approved ways to weld HSS, along with Mig Brazing. That said, I do not know what the OP's application, but since the original link was from Eastwood, I assumed (perhaps improperly) it was automotive.

Admittedly, I have hundreds of hours at the helm of different brands of squeeze type resistance spot welders, but NONE with TIG spot welding. As you know, just because a weld looks pretty on the surface and holds in a static, unstressed state, it might not have proper penetration. This is true of STRSW, Mig, or Tig. I'm just recommend testing especially when life and limb might be at stake.

[performance]

The Tig weld Because of the shielding, if penetration is verified would be much stronger and less brittle. It could also be plug welded in this fashion, though I suspect some steels wouldn't like the drilling.
Watch the video, and if you see the eastwood guy he is welding completely through creating a proper weld. It's much better than a spot weld that is held from one side only and where penetration is difficult to judge.

Spot welder may have high amp outputs, but looking at the total wattage, the voltage must be incredibly low to fit any standard 220 outlet, which would be around a shop. If it's at 10,000 watts as you say, even 1-2 volts would require a HUGE breaker, because you end up with up to 20,000 kw worth of power. (Don't think most weld at 5 or 6 k watts). Broken down to standard input power with just rough math that is a figure of roughly50- 100 amps....so..

And while a tig welder is using say a max of 150 amps to spot weld, the welder also is putting it out at 20 volts or so.

When you weld, you DON'T weld with volts or amps alone, you weld with wattage, and that is part of the equation....saying you are welding at 10,000 amps has little value or meaning if you don't also consider the voltage. Although voltage and amperage are different things, you combine them and you have wattage.

[Gearhead51]

Mark,

Proper Inverter STRSW machines typically run off of 80amp 3 phase power and produce very high power, short duration welds. Overheating of UHSS causes it to be brittle, so keeping the heat affected zone to a minimum is critical. I have gone in to train a technician on a welder, and shut the whole body shop down because they didn't have enough power in the box. I've had to ask power companies replace transformers, because they couldn't deliver enough power. The actual amp draw on the circuit well exceeds the breaker rating, but since it's in such short duration and low duty cycle, they don't trip. The new machines monitor the weld and vary upslope, downslope, and amperage a few hundred times a second. These machines are in the $20k+ price range, and they are becoming commonplace in the auto body industry. If you have a solution that is as effective and cheaper, you're sitting on a gold mine.

The magnetic field in the 1 1/2" thick, water cooled cables is so great that they "kick" apart a few inches for the 1/10 second the inverter hums.

http://collision.alldata.com/online2...RIB-174-W.html
http://aaspma.org/tech-tips-september-2012/
www.Prospot.com

I know I have a low post count, and I just bought my first TIG from you guys, but this is not my first time joining steel. I have just spent more time using a resistance welder than my mig or stick, as that was my profession. I do not work for any of these companies, and I no longer do any auto collision training, so I have nothing to gain by passing along this info. I just don't want to see people get hurt. At this point, I respectfully step away from this discussion.