HF works, but Arc wont start !!!

[tensecond408]

Well just been laying some test passes with the unit (PP256)

When I'm using the pedal and go to start the arc, I get the high freq arc jumping across the tungsten to the work piece but cant get it to actually start the weld arc. Everything is hooked up right (i believe), argon is flowing, tried at all different temps, tungsten can be barely away or far away from metal and same results... the ONLY way to get it to start most of the time is to MAX out the foot pedal and wait about 10 seconds and sometimes it will start but sometimes not. Up-Slope is set to almost nothing. I also found another way to get it to weld when it does this is to actually touch the tungsten to the metal and short it out.... like scratch start basically... but that defeats the whole purpose of HF. Ground can be clamped to table or actual work piece, same results.

Tried this same thing with a tapered tungsten and a balled , same results!

Anyone else having these issues?

AJ Newman

[performance]

What side is your torch in? What is your preflow set to? 2T or 4T? AC or DC? If AC, what is your AC freq and balance set to? What type tungsten? How old is your unit?

Never ball your tungsten.

[Gman]

This is the same problem I was having. The only way I can get a stars is to rest my cup on the work and roll my torch over till the tungsten is 1/16”+/-. After I get a flame I can move the torch into position. Even doing this, sometimes I get the HF and no flame. I try and roll it closer and the spark will get so small you can hardly see it. And before you know it my tungsten is stuck to the work.
I don’t know if this is the right way to do it, as this is my first time using TIG.

[francis]

Hi i have a power pro 205 and run the same issue a week before, turn out to be a defective foot pedal, works fine with the tig torch switch. Try it

[Gman]

My issue was on 2t, 2sec. pre flow, dc, 55-60 volts, no foot pedal.

[Rambozo]

My issue was on 2t, 2sec. pre flow, dc, 55-60 volts, no foot pedal.

2 seconds is a long preflow time. You are aware that the arc will not even try to start for two seconds from when you push the switch? The HF should be able to jump a gap of at least .125-.250". If it doesn't transfer to the main arc, check for possible ground issues. One person had the ground wire come out inside the rubber boot at the plug.

[Gman]

I've had the preflow all over the place. The 2 seconds is a +/-.
Yes, I can hold it 1/2" away and still get spark.
I'll have to check that.

[tensecond408]

What side is your torch in? What is your preflow set to? 2T or 4T? AC or DC? If AC, what is your AC freq and balance set to? What type tungsten? How old is your unit?

Never ball your tungsten.

The unit is brand new. Iv tried with 2% Lanthinated and 2% Thoriated. I dont purposly ball my tungesten, but when welding in AC with the balance high it will ball the 3/32 pretty quickly. Just stating that the tungsten tip shape didn't effect the results.

Same Results with AC or DC, but i noticed it started with AC then i switched to DC and was getting the same issues.

The torch is in the (-) negative port and the ground is in the (+) positive port. Switch mode is set to the pedal, post-flow varies 0-1 seconds, but never over 1 second, tried all different settings. AC Freq i usually have set to around 100HZ and balance is usually in the 10:00 o'clock position(also tried higher -but usually balls tungsten way to fast).

We have these issues at my work sometimes with the Miller syncrowaves, they get a HF start but no weld. This is always due to the ground not being hooked to the table.

Its just weird that it sometimes does it and sometimes dont....

Thanks for the help

[Rambozo]

The unit is brand new. Iv tried with 2% Lanthinated and 2% Thoriated. I dont purposly ball my tungesten, but when welding in AC with the balance high it will ball the 3/32 pretty quickly. Just stating that the tungsten tip shape didn't effect the results.

Same Results with AC or DC, but i noticed it started with AC then i switched to DC and was getting the same issues.

The torch is in the (-) negative port and the ground is in the (+) positive port. Switch mode is set to the pedal, post-flow varies 0-1 seconds, but never over 1 second, tried all different settings. AC Freq i usually have set to around 100HZ and balance is usually in the 10:00 o'clock position(also tried higher -but usually balls tungsten way to fast).

We have these issues at my work sometimes with the Miller syncrowaves, they get a HF start but no weld. This is always due to the ground not being hooked to the table.

Its just weird that it sometimes does it and sometimes dont....

Thanks for the help

A few points, first your post flow should be a lot more than one second, or the outside of the tungsten will get oxidized when it cools. That will make it hard to restart the arc for sure. A good rule of thumb is 1 second per 10 amps welding current more or less. Basically you want argon flowing anytime the tungsten is red hot.
Also please remember that Everlast's balance control is backwards from Miller's so 10%-30% is probably where you want to be. Inverters typically don't ball the tungsten if you are set right and using the right size electrode.

[everlastsupport]

Post flow should be 5-6 seconds minimum. On the balance. Miller is backwards, not us. Though you said from us, we are right. Set it to 30% range and work down from there.

[Gman]

Never thought of post flow. I've became somewhat of a pro at grinding tungstin.

[everlastsupport]

Never thought of post flow. I've became somewhat of a pro at grinding tungstin.

In the beginning most do

[Gman]

In the beginning most do

LOL, I'm very begining. But getting there.

[everlastsupport]

LOL, I'm very begining. But getting there.

You will hear practice practice practice all the time. It is very true. My sons have be welding from 10 and 12, now 17 and 22. People use to freak out when my youngest, at 12 years old, he would come up and lay down beads, TIG, MIG or stick. Was funny. School can also speed up the process or just someone to teach you. Or it can be self taught, sometime take a little longer to get it and a lot of research and hard knocks.

[tensecond408]

A few points, first your post flow should be a lot more than one second, or the outside of the tungsten will get oxidized when it cools. That will make it hard to restart the arc for sure. A good rule of thumb is 1 second per 10 amps welding current more or less. Basically you want argon flowing anytime the tungsten is red hot.
Also please remember that Everlast's balance control is backwards from Miller's so 10%-30% is probably where you want to be. Inverters typically don't ball the tungsten if you are set right and using the right size electrode.

Sorry for the confusion, that was suppose to say pre-flow... I understand how to setup the machine , iv been tig welding for many many years. The pre-flow is set to 1 second , post flow usually set to 6-12 seconds depending on application.

I get the same results with a freshly ground electrode.....

[Rambozo]

Sorry for the confusion, that was suppose to say pre-flow... I understand how to setup the machine , iv been tig welding for many many years. The pre-flow is set to 1 second , post flow usually set to 6-12 seconds depending on application.

I get the same results with a freshly ground electrode.....

I was thinking you might have meant pre flow, when you mentioned less than one second. The only thing is to check the torch and ground connections all the way back. You might even use an ohm meter to verify that there isn't any problems in the connectors that are hard to get to. It sure sounds like a bad ground. HF will jump right through poor connections, but not the main arc. And once you do get the main arc going it will weld a temporary connection through oxides and stuff, but will fail again when things move around either from moving something, or just cooling. One tip I have not tried, but should, next time I have a hard to ground part, is to wrap some bare copper wire over the part where the ground clamp is attached to give a lot more ground points.