Replacement argon hose with proper fitting???

[aland]

Has anyone replaced the plastic argon hose with a proper flex hose that has a fitting to screw into the argon flow meter?

Everlast ships the nipple to allow the hose to use a pipe clamp, but I would think it better to have a proper fitting that would screw into the meter, as well as the rear of the welder.

Anyone done this, and if so what did you use? I don't seem to see any replacements online. I think it's a 9/16 fitting possible, will need to measure it. I see a lot of 5/8 fittings on the hoses, maybe that is the correct one.

EDIT: it is a 9/16-18 pipe thread on the meter side.

Alan

[Grizzly1944]

Just use the clamp setup that's provided. You're not putting that much pressure through the hose.

[aland]

Just use the clamp setup that's provided. You're not putting that much pressure through the hose.

I agree with you, but the hose/clamp setup on the argon hose can't be adjusted, so I could either replace it with a pipe clamp, have those, but was thinking it makes more sense to get a real flex hose with compression fittings, that has to be better.

I guess nobody else has pondered that...'cept me...

Alan

[Rambozo]

There are some real advantages in replacing that hose with a small bore non-expanding type hose, as short as possible. http://www.netwelding.com/How_GSS_Works.htm

I make up my own as needed. Some flowmeters are NPS, NPT, BSPP, CGA, metric, etc. I've heard the new welders are all CGA-B now, but the older ones were different, usually ending with a hose barb. You can buy a hose off the shelf or make your own. Depending on what fittings you have, you may or may not be able to get one at your LWS.

The usual suspects for me are McMaster Carr, Maryland Metrics, Hoseman.

[aland]

I make up my own as needed.

Do you use a flaring tool with copper/brass pipe?

That link looks like it's for mig, but I'm guessing that applies to tig also, it seems the savings in in gas that doesn't leak out?

The usual suspects for me are McMaster Carr, Maryland Metrics, Hoseman.

I was just looking in the manual, but don't see it. I would go look at the machine, but it's frickin' cold and I'm heading to bed...later...will revisit this tomorrow, maybe my LWS can help out.

Thanks for the info.

Alan

[Grizzly1944]

i do run netwelding GSS's on my welders. The first thing I noticed is that the initial gas blast that can increase turbulence is almost gone. The other is that the restriction of gas flow is a gas saver. I do agree with Rambozo that several new welders are coming out with "b" fittings on their gas inlets.

[Rambozo]

If it's an off the shelf fitting, I usually just buy it from the places mentioned. If it is an oddball, or I want it right now, I just make it. The John Guest or push to connect type fittings with Nylon or poly tubing are a pretty easy solution. 1/8" will do the job for short runs.

The gas savings are by losing that huge initial blast when the solenoid opens. You wouldn't think that amounts to much, but you'd be surprised. Especially with fabrication work where you are doing a lot of tacking.

[aland]

The gas savings are by losing that huge initial blast when the solenoid opens. You wouldn't think that amounts to much, but you'd be surprised. Especially with fabrication work where you are doing a lot of tacking.

Bingo, now you're making sense. Thank you for explaining that. That could be something that I wouldn't have known for a long long time...I will get that changed over, it does make sense.

When I first hooked up my welder, I seemingly had forgot to connects the control. I set the argon pressure, everything seemed correct, but no argon turning on, so no solenoid kicking on...as I checked all the cables and hoses I saw the control wasn't hooked up... I don't have a pedal yet, it just shipped this morning, so without the switch there was nothing to control the solenoid. Once that was in, the welder worked like a champ.

You don't have a pic of your setup, do you? Seems it will be a hard line, so wondering how it compensates for any movement, I know the thin lines are kind of flexible. When I built my propane forge, which has been quite a while, I used a flaring tool to crimp the ends of the fittings/tube. Is that the type of lines we're talking about? I didn't see any actual lines at the link above for migs, I don't think...

Alan

[Rambozo]

I use nylon or poly 1/8" tube.
https://www.mcmaster.com/#9685T1

[aland]

I use nylon or poly 1/8" tube.
https://www.mcmaster.com/#9685T1

What type of connector do you use?

Looking on the McMaster site I don't see what would work. I think I need a 1/8" pipe and a 5/8 NPT (male). At least the plug seems to be that on the machine side. I need to measure the other end. But I couldn't find anything that was 1/8" -> 5/8" male NPT, is that such a connector that exists?

Thanks, I'm a bit slow...

Alan

[aland]

But I couldn't find anything that was 1/8" -> 5/8" male NPT

Nope, that's a 1/4 npt, I *think*.

Maybe I need this:

https://www.mcmaster.com/#50775k327/=1aync34

And/or coupled with this:

https://www.mcmaster.com/#50775k327/=1aync34

using the 1/8" nylon tube you linked to. I'll put it here for clarity in case someone else is looking for the same solution.

https://www.mcmaster.com/#9685T1

This is without the other end. Let me go check...

Alan

[aland]

Sorry, the forum will only let you edit for 30 minutes, I wanted to put it together and change the bad link on the second one in the previous message.

Suffice to say, I think what is needed is:

2 x 1/8" to 1/4 NPT https://www.mcmaster.com/#50775k327/=1aync34 (each end of 1/8" nylon line)

1 x Converter https://www.mcmaster.com/#7919a53/=1ayo3yj (machine side)

X number of feet of this line https://www.mcmaster.com/#9685T1 (on a cart you may only need a couple feet depending on tank/cart/welder)

Thanks for that famous bozo spin Rambozo, just like butchy boy used to get in the big top!

Alan

[Rambozo]

Compression fittings are kinda finicky with plastic tubing. You usually have to use a brass insert and that restricts the flow. They are very prone to leaks if tightened too little or too much. I prefer the push to connect type that seal with an O-ring. They are dead easy, can be disconnected and reconnected over and over and flat don't leak. Here is an example for 1/8" tube to 1/8" NPT. I prefer the brass ones. There are also plastic, and now there are half and half versions where the tube portion is plastic while the pipe thread is brass.
https://www.mcmaster.com/#51025k171

Here is an all brass.


And here is a half and half version.


(Still no working inline photos on the forum software? Come on people)

Some of the fittings you linked were for 1/4 OD tube.

Pipe is measured by nominal inside diameter, while tubing is measured by actual outside diameter.
The real trick is to accurately measure and identify what threads you have. There are so many variations that I would never try to guess exactly what you have without seeing it in front of me. Good calipers and a pitch gauge will usually do the job. Most US threads are 60 degree while British (China) are 55 degrees. Measure that and you narrow things down a lot. Typically you will probably convert from what you have to male or female NPT either 1/8 or 1/4, then to the tube fittings. NPT seals on the threads while CGA and a lot of other types seal with a spherical or tapered seat and not on the threads. So while some fittings might screw together just fine, they will not seal 100%. Since you are just starting out, there is no problem just using what was supplied until you are sure of what fittings you need to make it all work. I have one flowmeter that I was never able to ID what crazy fitting was on it and I ultimately took that barb fitting and brazed it to a brass bar so I could machine it to use standard fittings.

[aland]

Since you are just starting out, there is no problem just using what was supplied until you are sure of what fittings you need to make it all work.

Blasmphemy! Now you're sounding like a real bozo!

Actually that makes perfect sense, time to get some sleep and revisit this tomorrow.

I'm very pragmatic about getting my workspaces setup and comfortable. Not something I need to worry about, but seems like a cheap upgrade.

I should focus on padding beads...

Happy trails, time for me to get some sleep...

Alan

[Rambozo]

For example...

Here is a flowmeter that has 1/4" NPS input and should seal with a washer against the flat surface on the end of the threaded spud. While the output is 12mm x 1.0 with a spherical barb "sealing" against a conical seat. Except that the body is die cast zinc, and the barb is aluminum, and both are plated to sorta resemble brass. The problem is that the barb and seat have galled so there is no way they will seal completely and this is a brand new part. That can probably be lapped in to seal. The NPS threadform is also something where they played fast and loose with the specs. The angle isn't really 55 or 60 degrees, in fact it is different from one side of the thread to the other. Some portions look National while others look Whitworth. So lets say it is a mix of Imperial, British, and Metric. Only in China!

[performance]

Just loking at some of the Miller equipment. Flow meters have the same tubing as we do. So, since ITW took over smith and combined it with Miller, I doubt you are going to get much better in a stock configuration with any brand.

[aland]

The problem is that the barb and seat have galled so there is no way they will seal completely and this is a brand new part. That can probably be lapped in to seal. The NPS threadform is also something where they played fast and loose with the specs. The angle isn't really 55 or 60 degrees, in fact it is different from one side of the thread to the other. Some portions look National while others look Whitworth. So lets say it is a mix of Imperial, British, and Metric. Only in China!

Wow, that is very subtle on the barb, thanks for pointing that out.

Alan